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+ Earlybird updated Friday, November 6, 2009 

Economy: G-20 To Meet About Continuing Financial Support

• "The Group of 20 leading nations will agree this weekend it is too early to pull the plug on emergency support for the global economy and launch a new system of checks to help rebalance world growth and prevent future crises," Reuters reports. "British finance minister Alistair Darling is hosting the third meeting of G20 finance ministers and central bankers this year in St Andrews, Scotland" today, "aiming to put flesh on the bones of agreements made at a leaders' summit in Pittsburgh in September."

• "A senior House Democrat said Thursday he would push to extend unemployment insurance benefits through all of 2010 before the end of this year, when the eligibility window for new enrollees will shut down or begin to phase out for existing beneficiaries," CongressDailyAM (subscription) reports. "The projected cost of such a program is potentially $80 billion to $85 billion, according to preliminary estimates."

• "No large financial firm should be too big to fail, said two members of the U.S. Senate Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs Committee," Bloomberg News reports. Republican Bob Corker of Tennessee and Democrat Mark Warner of Virginia "are sponsoring legislation to give the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. the authority to force large bank holding companies into receivership. Any firm that benefits from a government-funded orderly wind-down would be required to close its doors permanently to avoid a perpetual series of government bailouts."

Monday, June 22, 2009

A New Depression After All?

This post on TheAtlantic.com sorts some evidence for how much the recession so far resembles the Great Depression, with some surprising results. In particular, it is interesting to think about the distinction between the United States and the global economy, and the role of industrial output. Is it right to compare things this way? Is any of this evidence compelling?

-- John Maggs, NationalJournal.com

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Responded on June 23, 2009 11:48 AM

Edward Leamer, Professor of Management, University of California at Los Angeles

The US is NOT experiencing a second Great Depression

Eichengreen and O’Rourke have designed some pictures that threaten us with the coming of the next Great Depression. Think of their pictures as Halloween outfits that hide innocent children.

The data so far do not come even remotely close to Great Depression levels. If we get this economy turned around in the third quarter, as the vast majority of economists expect, this will be the most extreme recession since World War II, but only slightly.

To calm us all down, we need to look at some other pictures. The image below is one of my favorites. It illustrates the decline in US industrial production from the previous peak from 1919 to 2009. The record was the 54% decline from July 1929 to July 1932 during the Great Depression. Through May 2009 we are only 15% below the previous peak in December 2007, slightly worse than the minus 13% recorded in March 1975

What really jumps out from this figure is the extreme volatility during the first half of the 20th Century compared with the second half. That should remind us ...

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The US is NOT experiencing a second Great Depression

Eichengreen and O’Rourke have designed some pictures that threaten us with the coming of the next Great Depression. Think of their pictures as Halloween outfits that hide innocent children.

The data so far do not come even remotely close to Great Depression levels. If we get this economy turned around in the third quarter, as the vast majority of economists expect, this will be the most extreme recession since World War II, but only slightly.

To calm us all down, we need to look at some other pictures. The image below is one of my favorites. It illustrates the decline in US industrial production from the previous peak from 1919 to 2009. The record was the 54% decline from July 1929 to July 1932 during the Great Depression. Through May 2009 we are only 15% below the previous peak in December 2007, slightly worse than the minus 13% recorded in March 1975

What really jumps out from this figure is the extreme volatility during the first half of the 20th Century compared with the second half. That should remind us how different the US economy is today than in 1929. One of the most important differences is that the fraction of employment in manufacturing has fallen substantially almost everywhere. This creates a highly favorable two-way increase in stability. Aggregate demand is more stable because less of it depends on employment in volatile manufacturing, and manufacturing is less volatile because aggregate demand is more stable.

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Responded on June 22, 2009 4:30 PM

Gary Burtless, Chair in Economic Studies, Brookings Institution

  Two key features of the Great Depression made it “great” - - its severity and its duration. Between 1929 and 1933 real GDP in the United States fell almost 27%. U.S. GDP did not return to its 1929 level until 1936. Real personal consumption declined more than 18%. In 1933 about one out of every four Americans in the labor force was jobless. The National Bureau of Economic Research, which is in the business of dating recessions, estimates that after reaching a cyclical peak in August 1929 the U.S. economy shrank for the next 43 months, by far the longest period of uninterrupted economic decline in the twentieth century. In the ten downturns since World War II, excluding this one, the average recession has lasted only 10 months. Even the longest post-war recessions, in 1973-75 and 1981-82, lasted just 16 months. In severity and duration the current U.S. recession does not (yet) remotely approach the Great Depression. Arguably, the United States is on track to experience its worst post-World War II recession, but even the most severe...

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Two key features of the Great Depression made it “great” - - its severity and its duration. Between 1929 and 1933 real GDP in the United States fell almost 27%. U.S. GDP did not return to its 1929 level until 1936. Real personal consumption declined more than 18%. In 1933 about one out of every four Americans in the labor force was jobless. The National Bureau of Economic Research, which is in the business of dating recessions, estimates that after reaching a cyclical peak in August 1929 the U.S. economy shrank for the next 43 months, by far the longest period of uninterrupted economic decline in the twentieth century. In the ten downturns since World War II, excluding this one, the average recession has lasted only 10 months. Even the longest post-war recessions, in 1973-75 and 1981-82, lasted just 16 months.

In severity and duration the current U.S. recession does not (yet) remotely approach the Great Depression. Arguably, the United States is on track to experience its worst post-World War II recession, but even the most severe post-war recession was mild in comparison to the downturn in the 1930s. After reaching a peak in the second quarter of 2008, U.S. personal consumption fell less than 2% over the next three quarters. The May unemployment rate was more than 15 percentage points below the peak rate in the Depression. Although most economists, including me, expect unemployment to climb for several more months, it will be astonishing if the rate climbs far above the previous post-war peak, which was 10.8%. The nation does not now appear to face an economic or humanitarian crisis on the scale of the Great Depression. In the second quarter of 2009, some indicators of U.S. economic performance began to improve or at least to decline more slowly. Consumer confidence, for example, has improved since the beginning of the year. Job losses declined slightly in April and May compared with job loss rates earlier in the year. After reaching a low point in early March, U.S. stock prices began to climb, and the creditworthiness of many of the nation’s biggest financial institutions appeared to improve. 

It is possible to cherry pick economic statistics and find some suggesting the onset of a downturn similar to the early months of the Great Depression. In many respects, however, the Depression began as an ordinary pre-war recession and then continued to grow worse for a frightening span of years. What is unquestionably true is that this recession, like the Great Depression, is world-wide. All of the industrial countries and many middle-income and poor countries have seen a drop in output and a sizeable fall in international demand for their traded goods. Among rich countries, the United States has so far suffered a relatively small drop in output. The latest estimates of GDP indicate that in the four quarters up to the first quarter of 2009, output fell 2.5% in the United States and 2.1% in Canada. The comparable rates of GDP decline were 3.2% in France, 6.9% in Germany, 5.9% in Italy, 9.7% in Japan, and 4.1% in the United Kingdom. On the whole, countries heavily dependent on exports experienced particularly rapid drops in output. U.S. exports have also fallen steeply, but imports have fallen even faster so the net impact of collapsing world trade has been proportionately smaller on U.S. GDP. In fact, because the U.S. has a sizeable trade deficit, the change in the net U.S. trade position has actually slowed the pace of U.S. GDP decline.

Some statistics that appear to show an unprecedented surge in bad economic news actually provide evidence that policymakers are dealing with the crisis expeditiously and in a sensible way. For example, one of Derek Thompson’s charts in TheAtlantic.com shows soaring federal deficits over the past 16 months, indicating a rapid deterioration in the government’s fiscal position. The surging deficit also reflects the effects of automatic stabilizers built into federal tax schedules and transfer programs and a planned response by Congress and the Administration to a severe economic emergency. If the automatic stabilizers and extraordinary policy responses work as intended, the present recession will be far less severe than the Great Depression. As has been notorious for more than seven decades, the policy responses of the Hoover Administration and Federal Reserve Board to the 1929-33 economic emergency were tepid and in many cases counter-productive. I expect the current Administration and Federal Reserve Board will do better.

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Responded on June 22, 2009 10:24 AM

Grover Norquist, President, Americans For Tax Reform

There is every reason to believe that Obama is doing what Hoover and Roosevelt did---turn a recession into a decades-long depression by deciding to “fix things.”  Hoover and Roosevelt both raised income taxes.  Obama schedules income taxes to rise at the end of 2010.  Hoover engaged in protectionism.  Obama and his congressional Democrats have already delayed or scuttled four free trade agreements and labor unions claim Obama has promised to continue this policy.  Massive spending by the federal government began under Hoover accelerated under Roosevelt and Obama makes them both look frugal.  Hoover and Roosevelt and Obama threatened and imposed wage and price controls over much of the economy.

  

Most importantly, the deliberate confusion and lack of certainly tanks investment and job creation.  Imagine thinking about investing in the auto industry or the pharmaceutical industry, or health care in general, or insurance or banking.  How could one rationally plan ahead?  One cannot and rational investors will not. 

 

The American economy did not come back until after World War II ended.  Let’s hope the parallel does not continue to that extreme.

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Responded on June 22, 2009 7:54 AM

Martin Baily, Senior fellow, Brookings Institution

Here’s a piece that responds to some aspects of the question, posted this past week.

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Latest response: Karen DavisNovember 03, 2009 12:18 pm
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August 11, 2009 4:00 pm